A pile of hand-drawn batik from Jeruk regency in Rembang (Source: Hello Guave)

Myrthe Groot and Romée Mulder met when they studied at the Fashion Department at the School of the Arts in Utrecht. Myrthe then studied art history and finished her Master in World Art Studies and Art of the Global World in 2015 while Romée started her bachelor Cultural Heritage at the Reinwardt Academy in Amsterdam.

Even after going on different paths studying, travelling or working as cultural heritage professional, both Myrthe and Romée remain friends and discover that they have never lost their passion for fashion and textiles. Inspired by their shared Indo-European heritage, friendship, common interests and values, Guave was born. With this label, Myrthe and Romée express their creativity and love for fashion, Indonesian culture and heritage.

In this episode of aNERDspective (our NERD talk show where we converse with amazing friends about their textile adventure and perspectives), we talked to the duo behind the fashion brand Guave about their heritage and experience in promoting batik in The Netherlands. 

Note: Full video is available on IG TV and this transcript has been edited for reading format.

 

Tony Sugiarta (TS): Welcome both Myrthe and Romée to this episode of aNERDspective and we can start with an introduction. Who are you guys, how you guys met and your journey in starting Guave. 

Myrthe Groot (M): I’m Myrthe and this is Romée. We have known each other for 11 years now. We met each other back at the Art Academy, where we both enrolled for fashion design and, after a year, we both quit with the study but we both remain friends. We found out that we are from the same part of The Netherlands. We were both from the Eastern part and both our dads are Indo-European or Indonesian Dutch. So, we bonded on that subject too. When we moved to Amsterdam, about five/six years ago and we moved in together. We found an apartment together and we actually started this research into our family history together so that we could share our stories together and, along with that, we actually never lost passion for fashion and textiles. That became something natural that we were interested more in our cultural background and then, related to that, grew an interest in Indonesian textile, specifically batik.

TS: How do you know that your dad is Indo-European, how was that conversation? 

Romée Mulder (R): It’s just like a fact that they had, this family cultural background and it was always a part (of us) when we were growing up, sometimes less and sometimes a little bit more. I think we both grew up with Indonesian or Dutch Indonesian food and family gatherings and things like that.

TS: What kind of food was that? 

R: Like gado-gado. And this colonial thing called rijsttafel (Rijsttafel, a Dutch word that literally translates to “rice table”, is an Indonesian elaborated meal adapted by the Dutch based on the hidang presentation of nasi padang from the Padang region of West Sumatra). That is like a Dutch Indonesian invention. All the dishes that contain rice, we grew up with them as well. Our grandmothers are from Java and they still could cook all the dishes and they did.  

TS: So it is not far along the family tree.

M: No. Romée’s dad is around the same age as my dad, but my dad was born in Surabaya and Romée’s dad was born in The Netherlands, but it’s the same generation. Our grandparents grew up in Indonesia, formerly known the Dutch Indies. 

TS: Do you guys go back to Indonesia often? 

R: We try too. We went there last February. That was the last time we went there and the first time we went together for batik trips and also to visit family. But we cannot go there every year.

M: After the last time, we said that we are going to do it every year, so we are planning to go in the upcoming year in 2021. We didn’t make explicit plans because of COVID now, so we are just going to wait around until Indonesia opens its borders again so we can go and visit family and continue the batik journey. 

TS: That is also the connection how you get into batik. So, how do you first discover about the textile? 

R: My parents had batik pieces at home, but I think with the knowledge that we have now, they maybe batik print, but it was the first introduction to batik motifs. Some of my aunts using batik in their clothing or use it as a tablecloth when eating Indonesian dishes. In The Netherlands, there are many Indonesian restaurant where you also find a lot of batik, either used as tablecloth or hang on the wall because there are so many people here from Indonesia or Dutch-Indonesian descents, batik are somehow part of their community and you can see it often if you recognise the motif. You can see it often at different places.

TS: Do you have any personal favourite motif? 

M: I don’t know. It changed because when we used to go on holiday to Indonesia, I was always attracted to what I now know as the batik prints. I always like the sogan colours because I think that is the most popular for tourists and people outside of Indonesia. But now that we did more research, also be more informed by Sabine, for example, I really like the North Coast, the bright colours, I think Buketan (‘Buketan‘, originally from the French word meaning ‘bouquet’ refers to a batik motif which formed the essence of Dutch Batik) is for me, for my eyes, aesthetically, I really liked that. 

TS: How about you Romée, do you have personal favourites? 

R: I am just thinking about Pagi-Sore batik. By accident, we received one with one of our orders from Java. When we ordered batik, we would get a big package that we select them ourselves. We only sell one side of the cloth on the picture and then we opened up the whole piece and it was a pagi-sore. It was the first we saw one. We saw many more on the last trip, especially in the batik museum in Pekalongan. They are so pretty. 

M: It is nice that you can wear two ways. That is multifunctional, sustainable. 

TS: Ever since I was doing this batik journey, different people has got their own personal favourites. It’s kind of like two different schools – the pedalaman, which is the royal court style, the sogan, and the North Coast people are also there, which is a very interesting mix.

R: Just like Myrthe said, we were more familiar with the sogan batik because you see it a lot more in The Netherlands. And people here think that it is the only traditional batik there is because they have never seen so many different batik.

M: I think there’s a feeling of nostalgia attached to the sogan colours batik for many people in The Netherlands because they recognise that it is from something that used to be in their home, or something that they can relate to their grandparents or families. I think it’s really interesting. Once in a while, we do polls on Instagram and ask the followers what they would like to see: a more bright colours or the darker colour, sogan ones, and it’s always kind of fifty-fifty. The interest for sogan colours is still quite wide large. It also has to do with taste, of course.

But we personally, we grew into the North Coast, I think. I remember at first I didn’t really like the line of the canting because your eyes have to get used to the fact that it is not really “correct line”. It is like hand-drawn, written, of course you see the handwriting in it. But we are so used to having clothes of textiles with patterns that are printed that is so neat and exact. At first I was like, I don’t really like this. I do not think that I would ever be able to turn this into a piece that I would wear. But now here we are and we really love it.

TS: So with that love you started this new brand, would you be able to tell more about the brand? First of all, how do you pronounce it? And what does it mean?

R: You pronounce this ‘gu-a-va’ and it’s like the name of the fruit. Of course, we did a brainstorm together to see what kind of name which fits best and then Myrthe came up with this really nice personal story that the first time she went to Indonesia and she ordered guava juice in the plane and she was attracted to it because it was a really nice colour, and really pink, and it is super bright and it is something different than orange juice. So we thought guava would be nice because the fruit also grows in different continents. You can create a bigger story around it if you want too, but it is not really necessary for us to have many layers behind a brand name, we just like this. 

TS: Nice, so it is just a nostalgic personal touch. 

M: It is out of the association that I had with Indonesia.

TS: Cool, and that was started in 2017. So, if you can share with us your journey with Guave, what you have created and started?

M: We started into batik actually with making clothes for ourselves, something that we wear. We get really positive response to that, like “Oh this is nice. This is batik”. We always discussed or talked with each other about starting a business, but we never really decided what or when. And then, after getting a positive response on the clothes that we wear, we thought that we should wear or make clothes from batik. We did some research and we guess there’s no real shop or other brand doing it (ed.: doing batik clothes), as far as we knew.  

TS: So you actually make the clothes first and then start incorporating batik? 

M: Actually we made the clothes from the batik prints. 

R: Because there are not many real batik available in shop. You cannot buy it, you can buy batik print on a roll. 

M: From the moment we decided that we are going to start a clothing brand, we are going to use batik because we think it is beautiful. Also, few subcategories disciplines, that we wanted to incorporate, such as sustainability, as much as possible. We had different talks with different people which one of them was Sabine Bolk. She taught us a lot about batik and the difference between batik prints and the real batik. Then we have to decide what we are going to do: are we going to support the batik craft and makers? or are we going to use cheaper textiles, batik prints. Actually, really soon, we decided to work with only real batik to support the makers and the art of making batik itself.

R: Also, sustainability was also really a big issue for us because the last year there is more attention to this topic as well. We did not want to be a new label only to bring new things into the world as many as possible without any awareness for the planet or people. So we try to be really critical on ourselves as well, with every step in our process to see what is the most sustainable option. It is never a hundred percent. It is really hard to say that you can be a hundred percent sustainable this quick. Maybe, I hope that it will be possible for us in future. But, to support batik makers, even though they are using synthetic dyes, it is, for us, the most sustainable and ethical thing to do.

It is really hard to say that you can be a hundred percent sustainable (ed.: especially when you just started). So we try to be really critical on ourselves as well, with every step in our process to see what is the most sustainable option.

TS: Definitely not a hundred percent, but what are some of the initiatives that you guys have so far in building a sustainable brand? 

R: Next to the batik, we wanted to use other textiles to offer people, not a complete batik outfit, but also to make it maybe more inclusive for more people. So we use one colour fabrics that are made in The Netherlands. They are produced here locally from recycled yarns or sustainable yarns. We combine them with batik for our reversible skirt, for the Guave suits, which we made almost two years ago already. That is a criteria for like other fabrics than batik.

M: Basically, what we all do constantly, because we cannot control the whole production line, is that we are constantly prioritising. With batik, the dyes are not always very good for the environment. However, maybe for natural dyes, you can wear maybe up to two years, especially in summer and the colour fades. In that way, it doesn’t last that long. Based on that point of view, we decided to work with the synthetic dyed ones. It is not that we are just saying “okay we’re going to do this” and then not taking any actions. We are trying to work a bigger plans for the future, to see if we can work together with the makers if we can work with less chemical dyes, etc. (We) make those plans for the future, but then there are small things that we can do (now), like using all recycled packages and paper as far as we can.

R: We try to go zero waste. All the small leftovers, we use for accessories or packaging or other stuff.

M: The ethic part of the whole production is also really important for us. We want the makers everywhere to get the correct amount of money for their work, a fair amount. That is important for us. That is also one of part of the reason when we produced the Guave suit, which is the only collection that we outsource, it was produced in The Netherlands to support local talents as well as to minimise the impact of the production. So it goes hand-in-hand. We have to prioritise because we are a very small business and we only have a few days a week to work on it. We do what we can and, from there, we try to improve constantly. 

TS: I would like to get back because you mentioned a couple of things along the production process. I’m very curious, in terms of the conception of your design. What goes through your mind when you are designing something for a collection, like combining different materials, which I find very unique. Can you share with us your thought process behind that?

R: Since we started to make clothes ourselves, since the beginning of Guave and that’s how we continue to work, actually. We design things that we would wear ourselves and something that we really like. Also with the idea that you can wear it, maybe not for your whole life, but for a long time. Perhaps, not really (to be) in fashion, we don’t want to hop on every trends. Of course you can do it, especially if you outsource things, but we would like to design clothing (which is) more timeless and long lasting. That is also why when we use fabrics other than batik, we want to make sure that those fabrics also are long-lasting and that they are good quality.

TS: Those fabrics are locally grown and woven in Netherlands? Or is it around the region?

M: The textile that we used, the yarn are all recycled (from old furniture) from other countries in Europe and it is woven in a factory in the Eastern part of The Netherlands. We always think what we like to wear, also not (to have) too many details in the clothing because we try to keep the design quite simple because batik is very colourful. It has a lot of patterns, so we do not want to make it too much of an overload. We try to give the batik a space for itself so that it can show on the body without having stitches everywhere, or details.

R: It (ed.: Batik) already does the work and it is also a challenge, of course, to work with batik because of its limited size and also, depending on the patterns, to decide what kind of design we use it for.

TS: The fabric that I saw on Instagram, you guys had a crowdfunding campaign in late 2019? 

R: Yes, we finished in late 2019. 

TS: If you can share a little bit of that (Kickstarter) journey and how is that part of Guave’s sustainable journey? 

R: Before we start the crowdfunding campaign, we made a small collections and the idea was to scale up. We want to make a bigger collection with one item that is unique. It’s all the same, but it is still a unique item. Also, business-wise, to grow as a label. We thought it was a good idea to set up this crowdfunding to reach more people, to challenge ourselves, to really work on it and to be able to finance this production. We did not want to make the Guave suit ourselves. We decided not to, so that we could do other things at the same time. It takes a lot of hours to sew or to produce an item. With this whole crowdfunding, we could reach a new audience and show people what we are doing. We learned a lot in this process. It was like a month, the limit, to reach the goal. We reached it and we gained 10,000 Euros, which was enough to produce a new collection and to cover all the costs. 

M: It’s a nice way to also know your supporters, your future customers actively, by having to start approaching people and tell your story. In a way, it is a very good promotion for your brand as well. We learned a lot and we did a lot. It was quite intense for a few weeks. but then in the end, it is so rewarding when you reach your goal. You feel that people believe in your brand and want to support it, so you can do what you what you wanted to do. That is really nice.

R: It was a little bit scary in the beginning and maybe awkward to ask for money. That is what you are doing basically and, of course, you wrap it in really nice words to like this campaign and in the end, you just want money from people. We had to learn that it is okay to do it if you have a bigger goal behind it. We also support other people ourselves with crowdfunding campaigns. We really like the effort that people put into their ideas. It’s like a shift of thinking, and changing your mindsets to make it work.

TS: Yes, definitely a very interesting insights there. When you are combining the two different textiles, one from the Netherlands and another batik from Java, how do you work with the producers in Java?

M: What we actually do is to leave the whole creative process of making batik in Java, with the makers. We do not even inform them that we are going to use the batik for clothing label. We choose from what we think is suitable for Guave. We do that because we think it is important for the makers to let them have their creative process. We do not want to be a company that is giving orders and assignments. It is also nice to see actually what they create. Besides more traditional patterns, we also get batik cap and other kind of batik that we also like. It is to follow the line of the creativity of the makers in Indonesia.

TS: From which areas in Java do you get your batik?

R: Mostly from the North Coast, the cap are mostly from Cirebon. Batik tulis is from Lasem. 

TS: You are mentioning that you worked with batik makers from Java and Lasem. I am just wondering, when you did your first sourcing, do you go down to Java or through online?

R: Through online. We actually got in touch with a woman in Jakarta, through Sabine actually. She has a lot of batik from the North Coast. She does her sourcing already and we buy the batiks from her. On our last trip, also the first time we go to Indonesia together, it was the first time we could do the sourcing ourselves directly from the makers. Now, of course, we have a lot of contacts of the people we met, so now we can also directly contact them. And as you know, it is really easy to do business in Indonesia, through Whatsapp and Instagram. It is kind of informal business, but we like, it is really easy to get in touch with them.

M: The goal is to build a sustainable relationship with the makers that we think we could work with, to collaborate and (to make) more sustainable things in the future. Of course, it takes a lot of time as we cannot travel to Indonesia at the moment, but that is one of our goals and what we would like to do.

TS: Definitely technology makes things easier for people to connect. But I would like to ask you, if you have any challenges that you face in your business.

R: I think one of the challenges is that people are kind of afraid, or maybe not willing to pay a fair price for fashion or for clothing. I think it is a problem in general but we faced that because batik itself has a high price. If you have a real batik and the production is in The Netherlands and it is ethically produced, the price will be higher than if you go to H&M, one of the biggest fashion company. That is really hard. And people in The Netherlands mostly have batik prints, because they have no idea. They never learn about the differences between a real and fake batik, bought a lot in Malioboro, Yogyakarta. That is all fine but then we have to tell the story behind it. That is sometimes hard and it is a challenge for us.

M: Sometimes, we want to deliver some items with three-colour batik tulis, but that pushes the price by a lot. It is almost impossible in the market as it is now. The item would become too expensive. We are trying to find some way in the middle.

I think another challenge is competing with batik prints. In The Netherlands, Romée also said, we are enthusiastic and we always want to share the story of batik makers and whole process, (to show the) worth that comes along with having a hand-made batik. But, sometimes, you see new brands come in, they want to do something with Indonesian culture and they use batik prints. If you want to give a real support, why not use batik? I think the challenge is to move away a little bit from the price and actually see the value of what you get. So they are two sides of the challenge, I think.

TS: It is definitely the same sentiment when meeting new people who just found out about batik or they do not know what they are, so it is definitely comes down to educating the consumers. How has the response been when you go out and introduce your products using real batik. What are the responses of your audience?

R: Well, they are very good. They, of course, see the worth of batiks and they really enthusiastic about it. They recognise patterns and colours. Everyone who really recognises, they have their own personal stories. I think they like it that we are working with the cloths again, like (working) with batik as a younger generation as well. People really like the clothing but if we are going to talk about price then sometimes people just… go.

M: We do get really positive response through the story of the batik makers and the making. When we explain how it works, how much time it costs, that is completely done by hand with the canting. We see people think about it and, sometimes, they go away. Sometimes, we also experienced that, after a few months or maybe a year, they become a customer, they come back to us.

We totally understand that not everybody is ready to pay the amount for items and that is totally fine. Not everybody has money or wants to pay the money. As long as we got the opportunity to tell about the difference between batik prints and real batik, then we reach our goal. We are very enthusiastic and we actually want to support the batik makers. So, if there is a person who is not a customer of ours, but he or she is going holiday in Indonesia and instead of buying batik prints, this person is going to buy a real batik, then our job is done.

As long as we got the opportunity to tell about the difference between batik prints and real batik, then we reach our goal.

R: Most people value the process and some people even learnt how to do batik at schools. I think, in general, people really like to know stories behind the products. Also with the new kind of trend, people want to know where the food is from, where the clothing is from, where the products are from, so we could also step in that direction.

TS: Do you actually have batik classes in The Netherlands?

M: I think our parents’ generation used to have it in school.

R: Yes, they have these kinds of classes at school.

TS: Definitely the discussion of costing is something that we also discuss a lot, whether it is too much, too low, and is it fairly priced. We know our customers and we cater to that particular customer group. That is how we also, like one of your initiatives, use different materials to manage the price. That is what we did with our collections as well. Batik tulis, batik cap, or natural dye versus synthetic dye, it is definitely a balance game. It is a positive response from the audience wanting to find out more about the process and how it is being made.

R: I was just thinking that people are also really searching for more contemporary batik designs because in The Netherlands, there are a lot of pasar malam (night market) organized.

TS: Really?

R: Yeah, because of the colonial history background, it is something that is still there. So throughout the year, there are many pasar malam and we have a big one in The Hague every year.

TS: Is that how they called it, pasar malam?

R: Yeah, everyone called it as pasar malam and in those events, there are many stalls with batik clothing, but most of them are batik prints. They are selling regular men shirts and everything that you also see in Yogyakarta most of the time. A lot of people here are familiar with those traditional designs. When people see us in one of those events and they say, “oh, you have more contemporary designs and that is something I am looking for. I really want to wear batik, but I do not want to wear my grandfather’s shirt because it is a little bit old fashion.” That is also a great compliment, I think. 

TS: That is exactly the next question: is there any specific patterns or colours that people in Europe or The Netherlands specifically like?

M: I think people who are just introduced to batik and like it, they tend to choose a little bit more for the graphic patterns or batik cap. The ones who are familiar with batik tulis and starting to appreciate it, they are really quick to choose to order an item with batik tulis because you can order and choose your own batik. That is the difference between people who just get introduce to and people who are already introduced to it a bit longer. I think it is different for every person.

It also depends on the colour and then the motif. Some people do not like the patterns and they are not going to buy batik, but when batik that has a colour that you like, it can be way more appealing to you, the difference between batik cap and batik tulis is not big anymore. There are so many variables in choosing and liking batik. I think it is very different for every person.

TS: Very interesting way to consider the different audiences as well. Your stuff are sold in The Netherlands, aren’t they?

M: Yes.

TS: The production?

R: Mostly we do it ourselves, but the Guave suit was the only collection we outsourced, and that was also made in Amsterdam. We own studio with machines, so we can (produce it ourselves).

TS: Is the studio open at the moment?

R: Yes, it is just like a workplace for us and we share with people, but it is not like a store. Of course, people can visit because there are still work there.

TS: I want to talk about your trip to Indonesia last year. Where do you guys go?

M: We did many places.

R: Have you seen the posting we did on Instagram?

TS: I did see the two-part videos.

R: We did a lot of filming, so you can expect more. We went there for three weeks, started in Jakarta and then we went to Bandung. We visited one more place, a batik workshop in Bandung as well. Then we went up to the North Coast, to Cirebon, and that was when the real batik journey started, when you are already at the train station in Cirebon, with Mega Mendung signs. It was really amazing and we continue to Tegal, that’s where my family is also from, but there are also many batik workshops, we visited one. Then to Pekalongan, Batang, Semarang.

M: And we also did trip to Lasem.

R: That was really early bus trip to Lasem, a three-hour bus trip.

M: Yeah, but it was really worth it.

R: It is the most beautiful place, I think. 

M: Especially when we visited workshop that is outside the city, that was really nice. We only stay for one day. We went back in the evening, from Semarang to Yogyakarta, and then we visit Surabaya to visit my family. The end of the trip was in Jakarta again. We had to combine a little bit of the family visits and the batik journey. It was to get first impression of different areas, different cities, and different workplaces, different scales of workplaces. I think we got a good impression in so many different workplaces, especially because we were so curious of the North Coast and all the batiks that were made there, the Mega Mendung in Cirebon and, of course, the Buketan. That was so amazing, we did a lot of places.

R: We try a little bit (of batik making) ourselves.

TS: How was that experience?

M: It was good experience, but it was difficult. So now you know that we have to be really skilled to make a beautiful piece. 

R: It was really interesting to see the differences between the workshops at home and…

M: And the ones factory-like.

R: But even that was kind of small. I think a beautiful thing about the whole batik industry is that it is not mass-produced.

M: That is impossible to mass produce and, I think, it makes the batik so authentic as well.

TS: It is definitely nice to finally see the faces behind, especially those brands and artisans you have been working with. Do both of you speak Bahasa Indonesia?

R & M: Well, sedikit-sedikit (a little bit).

R: I did a course before we went there, the basic language. So I practice when driving in a taxi, with the taxi driver, in the hotel, and when we met people on the street. I have to keep practicing.

M: One of the thing I should do as well.

TS: When you were talking with the batik artisans, how does that communication go?

R: I talked with some of them a little bit in Bahasa, like asking how old they are, how long they have worked at the place we visited. And a little bit in English and Bahasa Indonesia.

M: Sometimes a little bit of Google Translate. I was not really easy, but we manage it. It was nice. Some of the makers would speak English and, once, we had a translator.

TS: That must be interesting and enriching experience for both of you.

R: If it was not this year because of the COVID situation, it was a really good experience.

TS: Talking about COVID, how are you guys managing, with the brands or life in general?

M: With the brand, it actually went up. We decided to make our editions of masks and those were sold really quickly. Because we thought that if we have to wear a mask, at a least wear a pretty batik one. Those were very popular. We still get some custom-made orders. So we are really grateful and happy with that, and we cannot complain actually. For me, it was like giving the time out, which is really to slow down my whole life and is actually a good thing, in a way. This was like going back to your old life for a few months and we are experiencing second wave of restrictions now.

R: We do not really know what the next few months would look like. We are also organising some events with Sabine at the end of October. It was already restricted with limited amount of people who could join, and now there are even less people who are allowed in the room. So you have to adapt all the time, for everything and everyday. Every week can be different, so sometimes it is tough, but it is a challenge and for the business, we did very well in managing it. 

TS: Like Myrthe mention, you guys have some custom orders that keeps you busy in this pandemic, is there any other special initiatives other than the mask?

M: Not really. We are adding a new accessory to the collection and we are still selling Guave suit. We did not make a new collection because we do not want to over produce. The item we have designed before became quite popular, so we give people opportunity to order them as a custom-made, so they can choose the batik. We are still selling items that we have made (ed.: designed) in the past, but then we produce only when we received the order, we just want to make sure that we do not over produce and be left with a lot of stocks.

TS: In terms of pipelines, I think it is a good model.

M: Yes, for the upcoming year, we are in to transition to a complete made-to-order system. So we only produce once we received the order. 

TS: We have been talking for almost one hour now and probably there is any final thoughts?

R: Maybe the thing that we said before, take some time to research what real batik is and educate yourself about the history, the fabric and the techniques, before you buy batik prints, for example. Just think twice if you really want to support Indonesian culture, crafts, or heritage. That was my message, but also for you guys, we are really appreciate of what you are doing. That is really important, not everybody takes time to do it.

TS: How about you, Myrthe, do you have any final thoughts that you like to add?

M: I hope that we are shifting to a more conscious way of looking what we wear in textiles and crafts, and we can really appreciate those textiles and crafts more because as we have experienced it. If we look at a batik, it can tell you so many things. If you have batik from history, it can tell you so many things about places at a time, in that specific moment. It is valuable to understand history, but also to appreciate makers and the crafts itself, so I hope we are going to globally shift to (be) more appreciative of cultural crafts and indigenous textiles. 

TS: Thank you both for chatting with us today, I personally learn a lot and give me a lot of ideas. May we have a collaboration one day?

R: Yeah, that would be great. Maybe when we are at the same time in Indonesia then we can meet up.

TS: Yeah, either Indonesia or Singapore.

M & R: Yeah, it is not that far and we have never been there before.

TS: Thank you guys so much.

 

We hope you enjoyed this episode of aNERDspective. Check out the previous episode on IGTV and our gallery and store if you would like a piece of batik for your home or wardrobe. Yes, customisation welcomed too. You may also check out Guave’s website and Instagram for their latest updates and creations.

Image source and credit: Guave’s Instagram and website, unless stated otherwise.